RRE's Eclipse JIC Coil Over Suspension 
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Back to:  JIC Suspension Info


-----Original Message-----

Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 8:40 PM
To: john@roadraceengineering.com
Subject: first impressions...

Giant thanks for the effort you and your guys put out at crunch time and all.  I am truly impressed by your commitment and effort. 
Okay,  so first impressions on a short ride on the freeway...  Initially,  the car actually responds now when you turn it.  I remember when I first drove the evo and it reminded me of a much smaller car than it is and it feels a bit like that again. You think and it turns. Alignment managed to be pretty straight on the freeway-  touch more desire to go to the right but pretty straight.   The Michelin Sportcups want to follow every undulation in the road. You have to hold on to the steering wheel or the car wants to follow into the bump or grooves in the road a bit more. These tires always feel this way more that street tires anyway, btw. 
Okay, bumps.  the car is noticeably different now. I hear much more noise when i go over rough stuff.  Not a complaint but it is like the car went from making a softer bump sound to sharp hitting noises.  I  found the solution was to just go faster.  The car feels much tighter, smoother and generally poised at speed. 130 felt really solid. It didn't feel flighty or boat like any more would be the best way to describe it. Okay so the car is basically happier at speed now. I feel the expansion joints in the freeway a bit more but if i drive fast enough it goes away. 
I will let you know more after I do my Las Flores to Latigo canyon run tomorrow...
Hey,  INCREDIBLE EFFORT!  I am humbled.  Thank you very much and best of luck with the track days here-  make some noise- setup to make some money and have a lot of fun.
I look forward to finally tuning my car in the near future...
Mark McComsey


-----Original Message-----
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 11:20 PM
To: john@roadraceengineering.com
Subject: okay so I ran my malibu canyon run brakes and all...


I am just humbled... I need to get some serious track time on this setup.  Basically I ran my Las Flores Canyon, Piuma, Mullholland to Latigo canyon run and came away very taken aback. 
Anyone who drives with me knows I am not shy about high triple digit speeds or being completely sideways on a bike or car.  I feel like a wimp today and john, it is your fault!  Here is the routine:  After warming up things, a  decreasing radius turn with visibility and I mash the accelerator if I need to turn in to it and throw out the back through the turn.   That was before...
Okay so i go into the turn 10 miles an hour faster thinking okay I know this one and figure all that money i spent has to be worth something-  okay, that was boring. 
Another decreasing radius...Faster, another turn and now the Sportcups are almost to their proper heat range.   After another 15 minutes of this and i am going through downhill on Piuma.  Barely squeak from the tires and it is just planted. (Yes the r compounds don't make much noise anyway sideways but you get it)  
I do this for another 35 minutes and finally get things properly sideways on the downhill on Latigo.  Oh, so this is a for me, 55 mph decreasing radius that i am at 72 on full boost and the thing is, I really like it.  I resist the temptation to brake and keep the go pedal on and it just worked. 
On another note, It is nice to be neutral and be able to brake later too.  I have one turn on Latigo I always brake into and push in and evo and it just actually was neutral.  I have to buy brakes tomorrow, btw. 
I am going to really enjoy figuring this out.  The thing is after running my route 3- 4 nights a week I am reduced to starting over now and it your fault!   I really look forward to getting the motor and handling both working. 
Negatives: well you can't have your cake and it too:   I can't use my ramps to raise car because it sits to low and my nice aluminum floor jack barely fits.  managed to do a nice grind on my hitch while simply driving down PCH to the canyon and bottomed out the hitch. I looked at the brace and it was untouched but I will make new one that is lower profile because of how things are lower now.
Yeah, so I guess I will take the lowered center of gravity and all that goes with it but I am starting to look even less respectable driving this car with my clients!  I will have to work harder now so I can get another car sooner to finish turning this into a track car and it is definitely your fault.
It was a pleasure doing business with you and you really need to have a serious conversation with me about the business. I look forward to seeing what we both can come up with...
Thank you very much,



From: Alex Okun [mailto:aokun@virtusweb.com]
Sent: Friday, January 04, 2002 9:59 AM
To: SoCal-DSM@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [SoCal-DSM] JIC coilovers and Muller's tuning
alexcar2.jpg (54685 bytes)
I have to say that there is bad in having too much of a good thing. The most expensive JICs have so much adjustment that getting it right if you don't know what you are doing is pretty much impossible.

Even with them badly adjusted I spanked a C5 vette on slicks at Streets of Willow. I think I will completely humiliate him now. After John Muller got down with them I went from an understeering pig to a completely neutral car. John took me and Eric for a ride in my car and scared the shit out of both of us as he was taking the turns around RRE racetrack :) (Florence, La Dana, etc...)

Today I decided to do a final test and put my life in Johns hands :) I was on an inside lane of a really tight freeway onramp. There was a truck on the outside lane, if I waited for him I would be stuck behind him getting on the freeway. I decided that this thing could handle it. Floored it in 2nd like John told me to do, passed the truck before the lanes merged and got on the freeway doing 90. It's amazing how well it handles. I can't wait to see what it's going to do with racing tires on! I should find out soon enough though. Buttonwillow is on Jan 26/27. I'll post the results.

'99 GSX


From: Alex Okun [mailto:aokun@virtusweb.com]
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2001 10:02 PM
To: SoCal-DSM@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [SoCal-DSM] Willow Springs event / thanks RRE!

I would like to thank RRE for setting me up with JIC coilovers and John and Scot for helping me out with tuning suspension at Willow Springs event. It was a lot of fun starting out in the blue group and passing all the cars I came across and then moving into the red group and passing a a lot of people there. The poor Corvette owner that got ragged on at dinner is my brother in law, it was fun chasing him down the track constantly gaining on him, then watching him starting to push the car beyond it's limits to an eventual slide off the track as I pass him on the left. Best of all he got it on tape! He wants a rematch and he should have it at Buttonwillow.

'99 GSX (Now it can go fast in turns too)


From: Justin DuBois [mailto:duboisj1@netzero.net]
Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 10:31 PM
To: SoCal-DSM@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [SoCal-DSM] For Sale AGX, now Have JIC by John Mueller

lv10.jpg (14660 bytes)

I'm not new to coil-over, but John has impressive skills. I'm extremely please with the initial setup and feel of John's JIC installation on my car. In his words, "The car is now faster than you are", Oh yes..True..True..

I was originally running a AGX/GAB coil over setup with my own mods. I could never achieve the balance John has taken time and effort to figured out. I had a choice of putting a little more money into my old setup with tuning or (to use a photo lab expression) Dump and Re-Mix.

As it turns out, I'm glad to have put the car in John's hands and replace all 4 struts. Though my front AGX's were in good shape, I found the rear GAB's to be leaking oil. John also found some "questionable" bolts in my front strut forks. It always pays to let another set of eyes do some QC once in a while. When it comes to building a setup for 120mph corners, I know now John's got my back. Thank You.

I'll write more after I've been on the track. Street driving has shown rail like handling with a supple ride. I'm looking forward to pushing the envelope after the final alignment.

Justin DuBois


From: Justin DuBois [mailto:duboisj3@earthlink.net]
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 12:29 PM
To: SoCal-DSM@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [SoCal-DSM] OTC - Epoch

It was amazing. I could go on and on about how much fabulous track time I got, and all the technique tricks I learned, but that part of the event is not the kind of experience you can pass on by just talking about it. You need to be in the drivers seat to appreciate the volume of experience you can gain by running this kind of event. The crazy schedule, and obstacles to overcome will probably be more useful info to pass on.

I ran with the JIC Mueller setup. I'm not really sure what the rates are, I'll have to ask the next time I see him, and shake his hand. Its was really set up well. Its a credit to Johns years of experience how well the car handled. Any lack of speed was driver related. In a word, "Neutral". At the limits in a high speed corner, if I lifted, the back stepped out, If I kept in the throttle, it pushed just a bit. If I carried too much momentum, It would take me out. If I didn't carry enough momentum, I just ran slow.

Justin DuBois


From: Crzykdd@aol.com [mailto:Crzykdd@aol.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 10:57 PM
To: bay-dsms@yahoogroups.com; john@roadraceengineering.com
Cc: SoCal-DSM@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [SoCal-DSM] Le 24 hrs RRE

After 5 different suspension combinations, not much sleep, and 24 hours spent at RRE...I think my seemingly never-ending search for the "perfect" suspension has come to an end.

This past weekend I made a pilgrimage down to RRE, surviving miles of thick fog on 5 and Shawn's snoring til 6 in the morning ;), to have Mr. John Mueller install and setup some JIC coilovers on my ride (a 1G AWD for those not in the know).

I must say all that and the wait for John to get everything done was well worth it. The JICs not only handle better than any of the previous set-ups, but also provide much improved ride quality over my Shocktek/Koni combo I had previously. I have always been on a search, since day 1 of DSM ownership, to find a suspension setup that would allow me to have my cake and eat it too, so to speak. Meaning, handle great but w/out punishing my backside too much, as well as let me lower the car to a proper height (lets face it, stock height DSMs look like a friggin 4x4 truck, not appropriate for a sports car). My only complaint would be the paint scheme of the JIC parts, they make rice bois everywhere green with envy ;).

Id like to thank John for doing a great job for both listening and delivering on my expectations as well as all the guys at RRE who put up with me and let me mope around the shop while I waited for my car to be done. It was also cool to finally meet KFC-AWD from Irc, a long time socal dsmer (hope ya get that head gasket fixed Scot). Also a big thanks to Mike W who, always full of good stories to tell while ya wait, helped me with a turbine housing in need of attention, as well as let me get an extra hour or two of sleep before kicking me out of the shop.

As always, making the trip to RRE and spending some time there is never boring, being around so many DSM enthusiasts. I suggest any norcal people to give it a shot sometime (as long as you go to spend some $$ ;) its worth the 5-6 hr trip.


"I thought JIC *Magic* was just a slogan..."



From: KaLiErAcEr@aol.com [mailto:KaLiErAcEr@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2002 12:20 AM
To: SoCal-DSM@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [SoCal-DSM] JIC Magic and 2G's

I herby proclaim, John Muller the Man... As many of us SoCal DSM'ers know 2g's and suspension parts don't mix well, until the MAGICAL JIC's appeared for 2g DSM's, OMG is the only way to describe them, in combination with a few Go Fast goodies, Fidanza and Quaife and X clutch, Special Ball Joints. The lumbering 2g has been transformed onto a nimble canyon carver. The turn in is awesome, grip even with shitty Khumo tires is immense, the car rides like a Caddy and feels much more stable all round and in hi speed mode (120 PLUS). The transitions are crisp and accurate.. I would recommend this mod to any DSM

Thank you John and Mike



-----Original Message-----
 From: v2
 Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2001 11:13 AM
 To: SoCal-DSM@yahoogroups.com
 Subject: [SoCal-DSM] Mueller Da Man

 Well, I pretty much lived at RRE with Mueller for the past 2 nights... But boy as it worth it. Let me tell ya, this dude knows his shit about suspension and I'm sure about a few dozen other things as well. Making the decision to go with the JIC setup wasn't easy, especially on the pocket, and on top of it all, I wasn't too impressed with it at first after installing them myself. Like they say, sometimes too much adjustment is BAD. I quickly figured out that tryin to be my LOW Mr. pimp daddy DSM boy wasn't easy. 

There was definitely method to the JIC madness. First we did the back. Cycled em through, found the optimum travel, etc. Woah! I had no idea that a car that eff'n low could ride like a stiffer version of stock, incredible. When we tore into it further, it turned out that my front shocks were completely running on the bump stops with absolutely NO travel making the little lane bumps on the fwy feel like parking bumps at the mall. So we tore it apart, took the spring out, cycled it, measured the travel, cut the 4-inch bump stop, adjusted it to optimum, and slapped it back on. IT MOVES now!! I as thinking to myself, "Shit, how much can doing all these changes really matter??". Oh my... Took the car for a ride around the Santa Fe Springs race track for a bit. Took a few nice easy turns at first, then pushed it a bit harder, HARDER, and FASTER, looked at the speedo, "Shit, I'm taking this turn at  60!!". Got a bit over confident, took another a bit hammering the gas pedal, there went the rear end- So here I am staring at my rear end almost in front of me, but the funny thing is that I yanked the wheel right and controlled it like I never could have dreamed possible!! It snapped right back into place! Thanks to John "Suspension king" Mueller for setting me up and Mike at RRE for the shop space. I think I'm ready to take that yellow bumble bee lookin POS Porsche of yours now, John... :)




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